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Re: Website update

Jordi Gutiérrez Hermoso-2
On Mon, 2016-08-15 at 04:58 -0700, siko1056 wrote:
> Can you create a website repository http://hg.octave.org/octave-web with
> push rights for all GNU Octave Savannah group members and for Alex
> Krolick?

I've given you and Alex access. Test that you can `hg push` or `hg
clone` to

    ssh://[hidden email]/hg/web-octave

The repo can also be viewed via web here:

    http://hg.octave.org/web-octave/

(I opted for web-octave instead of octave-web because all of the
octave-* repos are clones of the octave repo.)

Sorry for the delay,
- Jordi G. H.



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Re: Website update

siko1056
Jordi Gutiérrez Hermoso-2 wrote
I've given you and Alex access. Test that you can `hg push` or `hg
clone` to

    ssh://[hidden email]/hg/web-octave

The repo can also be viewed via web here:

    http://hg.octave.org/web-octave/
Thank you Jordi, works perfectly so far.

Jordi Gutiérrez Hermoso-2 wrote
(I opted for web-octave instead of octave-web because all of the
octave-* repos are clones of the octave repo.)
That's alright for me.

Kai
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Re: Website update

siko1056
Some news about the "website project". I occasionally pushed some changes to the website development repository and the current status is visible here:

https://www.gnu.org/software/octave/new/

The design is very conservative and reminds more of the current website. Anyway, some great ideas from Alex approach [1] are part of it, but personally I considered the start page [1] too overwhelming. What remains is:

- Mobile friendliness
- Some examples on the first page (syntax highlighting)
- Put everythink under the CC-by-nd license [8], as the remaining FSF pages.
- [Possibility for MathJax equations, but currently not needed, so disabled for performance.]

Most of the changes are not visible to the user, here much more of Alex approach [1] paid off and I like to add changes much more, than before:

- Use Jekyll [2] to create static websites. (This I can really recommand)
- Content is written in Markdown, rather than HTML.

- An easy maintainable, consistent News Feed system (read more at [3] link to try is [4]) this should be integrated into the Wiki using the RSS extension [5] as well. Especially communicating a release is more straight forward, for an example see [6].

- Develop the website outside the Savannah CVS repository using HG [7]. In Savannah CVS it only needs to be deployed. Interested website developers can work on it without group membership at Savannah.

Comments?

Kai.

[1] http://alexkrolick.github.io/octave-web/
[2] https://jekyllrb.com/
[3] https://www.gnu.org/software/octave/new/README.md
[4] https://www.gnu.org/software/octave/new/feed.xml
[5] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:RSS
[6] https://www.gnu.org/software/octave/new/news/2016/07/02/octave-4.0.3-released.html
[7] http://hg.octave.org/web-octave/
[8] https://www.gnu.org/licenses/license-list.html#OpinionLicenses
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Re: Website update

Alex Krolick
On Oct 18 2016, at 2:13 am, siko1056 <[hidden email]> wrote:

Some news about the "website project". I occasionally pushed some changes to
the website development repository and the current status is visible here:

https://www.gnu.org/software/octave/new/

The design is very conservative and reminds more of the current website.
Anyway, some great ideas from Alex approach [1] are part of it, but
personally I considered the start page [1] too overwhelming. What remains
is:

- Mobile friendliness
- Some examples on the first page (syntax highlighting)
- Put everythink under the CC-by-nd license [8], as the remaining FSF pages.
- [Possibility for MathJax equations, but currently not needed, so disabled
for performance.]

Most of the changes are not visible to the user, here much more of Alex
approach [1] paid off and I like to add changes much more, than before:

- Use Jekyll [2] to create static websites. (This I can really recommand)
- Content is written in Markdown, rather than HTML.

- An easy maintainable, consistent News Feed system (read more at [3] link
to try is [4]) this should be integrated into the Wiki using the RSS
extension [5] as well. Especially communicating a release is more straight
forward, for an example see [6].

- Develop the website outside the Savannah CVS repository using HG [7]. In
Savannah CVS it only needs to be deployed. Interested website developers can
work on it without group membership at Savannah.

Comments?

Kai.

[1] http://alexkrolick.github.io/octave-web/
[2] https://jekyllrb.com/
[3] https://www.gnu.org/software/octave/new/README.md
[4] https://www.gnu.org/software/octave/new/feed.xml
[5] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:RSS
[6]
https://www.gnu.org/software/octave/new/news/2016/07/02/octave-4.0.3-released.html
[7] http://hg.octave.org/web-octave/
[8] https://www.gnu.org/licenses/license-list.html#OpinionLicenses

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Hi Kai,

Thank you for taking the time and porting over the website repository to Mercurial. I am biased since I laid out the first draft, but I prefer the previous iteration of the page design [1]. That design was inspired by the recent relaunch of the GNU Guile website [2] which was well-received by the community and really gave a new face to the language.

In particular I'd like to see:

  • Prominent calls-to-action on the page (download, docs, etc.)
  • Skimmable page sections/headings
  • Screenshots that showcase the GUI and graphics system
  • Detailed page footer with expanded navigation view
  • Better documentation for the Forge package ecosystem

[1] https://alexkrolick.github.io/octave-web/
[2] https://www.gnu.org/software/guile/

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Re: Website update

Sebastian Schöps
Alex Krolick wrote
Hi Kai,

Thank you for taking the time and porting over the website repository to
Mercurial. I am biased since I laid out the first draft, but I prefer the
previous iteration of the page design [1]. That design was inspired by the
recent relaunch of the GNU Guile website [2] which was well-received by the
community and really gave a new face to the language.

In particular I'd like to see:

  * Prominent calls-to-action on the page (download, docs, etc.)
  * Skimmable page sections/headings
  * Screenshots that showcase the GUI and graphics system
  * Detailed page footer with expanded navigation view
  * Better documentation for the Forge package ecosystem
 
[1] https://alexkrolick.github.io/octave-web/
[2] https://www.gnu.org/software/guile/
My 2 cents: I'd agree, that Alex' proposal [1] looks fresher and feels lighter while [2] is already much better that the current page but still rather old fashioned.

Are we ready to publish the new website along with the new 4.2 release? That would be cool!

Seb.
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Re: Website update

siko1056
Sebastian Schöps wrote
Are we ready to publish the new website along with the new 4.2 release? That would be cool!
This is possible. I also agree with Alex design, but while working on his proposal, I think at least the following should be changed:

1. No extra example page, just a few on the landing page: This is a nice idea, but we have a [wiki][1], including Syntax highlighting, where more authors can provide better examples. On the website the maintenance is up to very few people.

2. Reduce to only needed [CSS][2] and [Javascript][3], what is is actually all good for? More documentation.

3. Merging [my work on the News Feeds][4]. To have a central distribution place for important release news.

@Alex, if you agree, I suggest to branch again from [changeset 38][5] and pick some cherries from my branch, that can be closed afterwards. Do you have write access?

Kai

[1]: http://wiki.octave.org/Category:Tutorials
[2]: http://hg.octave.org/web-octave/file/79cbd4801fa8/css
[3]: http://hg.octave.org/web-octave/file/79cbd4801fa8/js
[4]: https://www.gnu.org/software/octave/new/news.html
[5]: http://hg.octave.org/web-octave/rev/79cbd4801fa8
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Re: Website update

Alex Krolick
On Oct 25 2016, at 1:58 am, siko1056 <[hidden email]> wrote: 

Sebastian Schöps wrote
> Are we ready to publish the new website along with the new 4.2 release?
> That would be cool!

This is possible. I also agree with Alex design, but while working on his
proposal, I think at least the following should be changed:

1. No extra example page, just a few on the landing page: This is a nice
idea, but we have a [wiki][1], including Syntax highlighting, where more
authors can provide better examples. On the website the maintenance is up to
very few people.

2. Reduce to only needed [CSS][2] and [Javascript][3], what is is actually
all good for? More documentation.

3. Merging [my work on the News Feeds][4]. To have a central distribution
place for important release news.

@Alex, if you agree, I suggest to branch again from [changeset 38][5] and
pick some cherries from my branch, that can be closed afterwards. Do you
have write access?

Kai

[1]: http://wiki.octave.org/Category:Tutorials
[2]: http://hg.octave.org/web-octave/file/79cbd4801fa8/css
[3]: http://hg.octave.org/web-octave/file/79cbd4801fa8/js
[4]: https://www.gnu.org/software/octave/new/news.html
[5]: http://hg.octave.org/web-octave/rev/79cbd4801fa8

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  1. No extra example page. - That's ok, but we should make sure there are some nice examples on the wiki we can link to directly.
  2. Reduce CSS/JS - Only the relevant components from the Foundation framework were included in the CSS, as far as I remember. Foundation has a customization page[1] and docs[2].
  3. News Feed - Great, will start with that. I have write access.
[1]: http://foundation.zurb.com/sites/download.html/
[2]: http://foundation.zurb.com/sites/docs/v/5.5.3/
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Re: Website update

siko1056
Alex Krolick wrote
  1. No extra example page. - That's ok, but we should make sure there are some nice examples on the wiki we can link to directly.
  2. Reduce CSS/JS - Only the relevant components from the Foundation framework were included in the CSS, as far as I remember. Foundation has a customization page[1] and docs[2].
  3. News Feed - Great, will start with that. I have write access.

[1]: http://foundation.zurb.com/sites/download.html/

[2]: http://foundation.zurb.com/sites/docs/v/5.5.3/
Some proposal for 1: http://wiki.octave.org/Using_Octave.

Kai.
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Re: Website update

siko1056
siko1056 wrote
Alex Krolick wrote
  1. No extra example page. - That's ok, but we should make sure there are some nice examples on the wiki we can link to directly.
  2. Reduce CSS/JS - Only the relevant components from the Foundation framework were included in the CSS, as far as I remember. Foundation has a customization page[1] and docs[2].
  3. News Feed - Great, will start with that. I have write access.

[1]: http://foundation.zurb.com/sites/download.html/

[2]: http://foundation.zurb.com/sites/docs/v/5.5.3/
Some proposal for 1: http://wiki.octave.org/Using_Octave.

Kai.
I basically reverted most of my design changes and integrated the news within your proposal and the examples are gone. The [latest repo state][1] is [now visible online][2].

Best,
Kai

[1]: http://hg.octave.org/web-octave/
[2]: https://www.gnu.org/software/octave/new/
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Re: Website update

Alex Krolick
Sent from Nylas N1, the extensible, open source mail client.

On Oct 31 2016, at 6:20 pm, siko1056 <[hidden email]> wrote:

siko1056 wrote


>
> Alex Krolick wrote
>> 1. No extra example page. - That's ok, but we should make sure there
>> are some nice examples on the wiki we can link to directly.
>> 2. Reduce CSS/JS - Only the relevant components from the Foundation
>> framework were included in the CSS, as far as I remember. Foundation has
>> a customization page[1] and docs[2].
>> 3. News Feed - Great, will start with that. I have write access.
>>
>> [1]: http://foundation.zurb.com/sites/download.html/
>>
>> [2]: http://foundation.zurb.com/sites/docs/v/5.5.3/
> Some proposal for 1: http://wiki.octave.org/Using_Octave.
>
> Kai.

I basically reverted most of my design changes and integrated the news

within your proposal and the examples are gone. The [latest repo state][1]
is [now visible online][2].

Best,
Kai

[1]: http://hg.octave.org/web-octave/
[2]: https://www.gnu.org/software/octave/new/

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Kai,
Nice. Looks good. I like the newsfeed page: https://www.gnu.org/software/octave/new/news.html. Would be great to deploy this with the 4.2 release announcement!

-Alex

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Re: Website update

siko1056
Alex Krolick wrote
>> 2. Reduce CSS/JS - Only the relevant components from the Foundation  
>> framework were included in the CSS, as far as I remember. Foundation has  
>> a customization page[1] and docs[2].
>>  
>> [1]: <http://foundation.zurb.com/sites/download.html/> 
>> [2]: <http://foundation.zurb.com/sites/docs/v/5.5.3/> 

Would be great to deploy this with the 4.2 release announcement!
Alex,

In the repo I already added the release announcement and removed some unused CSS for syntax highlighting, except for one file with the actual styles. The changes are not visible online yet.

Do you think it is worth upgrading to [Foundation v.6.2.4][1]? I don't have that much experience with this framework, especially if I break something by naive upgrading the scripts and styles.

If you try out the repo version, I find the horizontal scrolling that occurs by minimizing the browser windows annoying. This happens already in [your first version][2]. Has this something to do with the div-wrapper or some bad column layout?

Best,
Kai

[1]: http://foundation.zurb.com/sites/docs/
[2]: https://alexkrolick.github.io/octave-web/
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Re: Website update

Alex Krolick
On Nov 1 2016, at 2:55 am, siko1056 <[hidden email]> wrote: 

Alex Krolick wrote
>>> 2. Reduce CSS/JS - Only the relevant components from the Foundation
>>> framework were included in the CSS, as far as I remember. Foundation has
>>> a customization page[1] and docs[2].
>>>
>>> [1]: &lt;http://foundation.zurb.com/sites/download.html/&gt;
>>> [2]: &lt;http://foundation.zurb.com/sites/docs/v/5.5.3/&gt;
>
> Would be great to deploy this with the 4.2 release announcement!

Alex,

In the repo I already added the release announcement and removed some unused
CSS for syntax highlighting, except for one file with the actual styles. The
changes are not visible online yet.

Do you think it is worth upgrading to [Foundation v.6.2.4][1]? I don't have
that much experience with this framework, especially if I break something by
naive upgrading the scripts and styles.


Foundation 6 doesn't really offer much over 5 for a site this simple. There are some breaking changes in the classes used to make navbars, etc., so upgrading would take a bit of effort -- not worth it in my opinion.

If you try out the repo version, I find the horizontal scrolling that occurs
by minimizing the browser windows annoying. This happens already in [your
first version][2]. Has this something to do with the div-wrapper or some bad
column layout?


I don't have Hg set up on this computer right now but I see there is an issue with the column layout causing overflow. This seems to fix it:
1) change the "row" class on the outermost "wrapper" div to "column"
2) add "row" to "page-content"
3) move the footer up inside the "page-content" div
4) change the donation columns to "small-12 medium-9/small-12 medium-3" so the button doesn't overflow

If that is unclear I'll try to do it later.

Best,
Kai

[1]: http://foundation.zurb.com/sites/docs/
[2]: https://alexkrolick.github.io/octave-web/

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--
Alex

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Re: Website update

siko1056
Alex Krolick wrote
1) change the "row" class on the outermost "wrapper" div to "column"

2) add "row" to "page-content"

3) move the footer up inside the "page-content" div

4) change the donation columns to "small-12 medium-9/small-12 medium-3" so the
button doesn't overflow

5) <from private communication> change the class on the footer from "row" to "column" after you move it
All done. The final version can be [seen online][1].

Kai.

[1]: https://www.gnu.org/software/octave/new/
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Re: Website update

John W. Eaton
Administrator
On 11/02/2016 05:57 AM, siko1056 wrote:

> Alex Krolick wrote
>> 1) change the "row" class on the outermost "wrapper" div to "column"
>>
>> 2) add "row" to "page-content"
>>
>> 3) move the footer up inside the "page-content" div
>>
>> 4) change the donation columns to "small-12 medium-9/small-12 medium-3" so
>> the
>> button doesn't overflow
>>
>> 5)
>> <from private communication>
>>  change the class on the footer from "row" to "column" after you move it
>
> All done. The final version can be [seen online][1].
>
> Kai.
>
> [1]: https://www.gnu.org/software/octave/new/

Kai, Alex:  This new design looks great to me.  Thanks for all your work.

What do we need to do to put it on gnu.org?

Where is it hosted and who can push commits for the web pages?

jwe


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Re: Website update

siko1056
John W. Eaton wrote
What do we need to do to put it on gnu.org?
Actually, it is already on gnu.org, but in a subdirectory of the current webpage:

https://www.gnu.org/software/octave/ (what http://www.octave.org links to)
https://www.gnu.org/software/octave/new/ (the new one)

John W. Eaton wrote
Where is it hosted and who can push commits for the web pages?
In short:

The *development* is hosted in a mercurial repository created by Jordi, namely http://hg.octave.org/web-octave/. Anyone who asks Jordi for permission, can push changes there, reading+cloning is always possible. Currently Alex and I work there, anyone is welcome!

The *deployment* happens via Savannah's CVS repo ( http://web.cvs.savannah.gnu.org/viewvc/octave/?root=octave ) like with the current website. So all of the 22 members of the Octave Savannah group ( https://savannah.gnu.org/project/memberlist.php?group=octave ) can deploy the new website.

In long: http://hg.octave.org/web-octave/file/tip/README.md

In shorter: if the 4.2 release happens, or you give a go, I can deploy the website. But I hope it is possible for others, especially for you, to make changes on your own, as well.

Best,
Kai
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Re: Website update

Oliver Heimlich
In reply to this post by siko1056


On 01.11.2016 02:10, siko1056 wrote:
> [2]: https://www.gnu.org/software/octave/new/

Nice, some minor remarks:

1. Without JavaScript, the margin between the menu bar and the content
is wrong (too small / negative).

2. Without JavaScript, the menu is invisible on my phone.

3. I would not put a link to Matlab on the website.

Best
Oliver

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Re: Website update

Pantxo
Oliver Heimlich wrote
On 01.11.2016 02:10, siko1056 wrote:
> [2]: https://www.gnu.org/software/octave/new/

Nice, some minor remarks:

1. Without JavaScript, the margin between the menu bar and the content
is wrong (too small / negative).

2. Without JavaScript, the menu is invisible on my phone.

3. I would not put a link to Matlab on the website.

Best
Oliver
Great job.

Another minor remark: the plots on the front page all use the Courier font which looks ... old. Maybe using a modern sans serif font would make them look more up to date.

Pantxo
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Re: Website update

Mike Miller-4
On Wed, Nov 02, 2016 at 10:20:59 -0700, Pantxo wrote:
> Another minor remark: the plots on the front page all use the Courier font
> which looks ... old. Maybe using a modern sans serif font would make them
> look more up to date.

Yes, the color schemes are also out of date now. All plots should be
redone using 4.2 and a consistent sans serif font.

--
mike

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Re: Website update

Pantxo
Mike Miller-4 wrote
On Wed, Nov 02, 2016 at 10:20:59 -0700, Pantxo wrote:
> Another minor remark: the plots on the front page all use the Courier font
> which looks ... old. Maybe using a modern sans serif font would make them
> look more up to date.

Yes, the color schemes are also out of date now. All plots should be
redone using 4.2 and a consistent sans serif font.

--
mike
Using svg format for the web page would also be a good point:
* it is scalable
* it is the only format that has the grid line transparency right

I tried to reproduce the current website images using qt (it was gunplot right?). I attached the svg images produced using the current dev version of gl2ps [1] (simpleplot.svg, sombrero.svg).

[1] previous versions use the "baseline-shift" attribute for text vertical alignment, which is not supported by firefox and librsvg at least.
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Re: Website update

John W. Eaton
Administrator
In reply to this post by Oliver Heimlich
On 11/02/2016 12:32 PM, Oliver Heimlich wrote:

>
>
> On 01.11.2016 02:10, siko1056 wrote:
>> [2]: https://www.gnu.org/software/octave/new/
>
> Nice, some minor remarks:
>
> 1. Without JavaScript, the margin between the menu bar and the content
> is wrong (too small / negative).
>
> 2. Without JavaScript, the menu is invisible on my phone.

Is javascript necessary now?  If we can't eliminate it, can we minimize
its use and try to make it so basic things still work even if it is
disabled?

> 3. I would not put a link to Matlab on the website.

Agree.

jwe



1234